Chris Ciagne, High School Principal, St. Clement, Centerline
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How did you get your start in lay ministry?

I am in education where I began as a high school teacher and I did get my start in the public schools, the Detroit Public Schools. Although I had a real good experience there, I had the opportunity to teach with the Christian brothers who taught me at Brother Rice High School. So that began my experience as a teacher, as a lay minister in the catholic schools when I taught at Seton Catholic High School in Chandler, Arizona and then I later had the opportunity to teach at the Archdiocese of Detroit, where I am now a principal of a small catholic high school.

People may not think a catholic school principal is a lay minister, but it is, isn't it?

Yes, I think when I became a principal, I didn't necessarily think of myself immediately as a lay minister but as a principal of a catholic high school. It's my responsibility to create an atmosphere that is Christ-centered. The parents that send their children to our school are investing quite a bit in their children and expect that they're getting something above and beyond of what they might get in a secular environment; that is in a public school environment. So all of us I think in parochial education are lay ministers in a sense and that faith is central to what we're doing in our professional lives. Therefore, we as catholic educators are lay ministers.

Why did you choose this career path? Who influenced you to do this?

I had gone to catholic schools my whole life. I can specifically remember being in my early 20's still not with a strong notion of what I wanted to do for a career and what I tried to do is set money or compensation aside and consider what would make me want to get up in the morning and what would give me what my father refers to as that "psychic income." I pictured a lot of the teachers that I had had over the years; particularly a number of the Christian brothers that I had at Brother Rice, and I thought of them and the impact they had on my life. I consider them to be the most influential people in my life outside of my parents and close relatives so I decided that would be the route that I would want to go in hopes of having that impact on other people.

Has that worked?

I hope so. They say later on when they come back and thank you is when you receive that. Yes it's been satisfying, absolutely.

You mentioned the term "psychic income." What does that mean?

You know my father, besides being a stock broker for a living—and that's what I did initially out of college was I joined him in the brokerage business before I became an educator and then later left education and spent a couple years in sales—but he did stress to us that when the alarm clock goes off, a lot of people are not real crazy about going off to where they are headed off to. They don't like their jobs a whole lot, so he always stressed you would want to find something that not only brought you the monetary rewards that you needed but also that "psychic income" or satisfaction in what you are doing. And for me, despite being in the brokerage business and sales which had the greater monetary rewards, I didn't feel that sense of satisfaction that I felt as an educator and now as a principal.

What do you like about your job?

Young people are fun to be around. They are not quite as jaded or cynical. Imparting information and kind of guiding them in that enlightment process and what have you--I think a lot of times it's not the content material that the students retain or remember. A lot of that goes in one ear and out the other or you learn it for the test and then it's gone. It's more the way the adults conduct themselves around them or maybe the adults that took an interest in them. I think we can all remember a few adults outside of our family that took in interest in us as young people and just the impact they had on us. The fact that that made us feel special; that this person would actually care about my problems; that this teacher was actually interested enough to come to our basketball game in the evening or what have you. So in a catholic school environment, I think you have that opportunity that you don't have in the secular world or in the business world to make a difference or to influence them.

You had the opportunity to experience the business world yourself. What was it like and why did you leave it?

After eight years of teaching, I had the opportunity to join the Detroit Tiger Organization, and being a baseball nut it was an opportunity I couldn't pass up. We began a fundraising department at the Tigers where schools could sell Tiger tickets and keep half the money from those sales. So joining the Tigers was really an opportunity, in a sense to help a lot of schools fundraise. Now they did away with that program in the years leading up to the closing of the old stadium as sales grew. So I was put in the ticket sales department with everybody else and sold group and season tickets and enjoyed success doing that. It was commission driven and I became director of ticket sales the last year in the old stadium and handled the transition process into the new stadium where our department also got involved in the selling of the suites and the various amenities that the older park didn't offer. So I really enjoyed the sales. It really made your blood flow and the financial rewards were there as well, but I think I always felt it was a temporary thing and that I ultimately would end up back in education. Sure enough, five years later I decided to return this time as an administrator and I was able to apply a lot of the administrative experience that I gained at the Tigers in the school environment because I managed people at the Tigers and as a high school principal it's really about managing people and the building. It was a good experience but it left me without that satisfaction that I was doing anything more than selling a seat to a baseball game.

Its sounds like you had a prestigious job with the Tigers, probably a big salary, lots of attention, yet it wasn't enough?

They weren't winning enough. The stadium was empty!

In sales, it can often require long hours. The thinking was whatever you need to do to close the deal; after working an entire day you were often expected to entertain clients at the game or be present to manage the sales efforts at the game. My wife and I made the decision to start a family, so part of my decision to go into education was also about I think of quality of life as well. It afforded me the opportunity to spend less time at work and more time with our young children but as far as the sales job itself and the prestige that might have gone along with it or the money—and the money was double at the other job than what it is now to the principal's job--and part of the reason that I was able to make that change is because we are a dual income family. My wife works as well, so that made the transition easier but still at the end of the day if you're chasing the carrot so to speak, or you're working really solely for the paycheck--that wasn't enough for me and what I might've lost in monetary income I think that I've gained in other areas that "psychic income" that we referred to.

How is the compensation in lay ministry?

Compensation is lay ministry, particularly in catholic education is getting better. I think it all really depends on what your priorities are; naturally, we'd all like to have unlimited resources but I think most of us find that we can get by with a lot less than we may have imagined. So again, I have no problem paying or meeting my fixed expenses on a principal's salary and that's with raising 2 young children. It certainly helps that my wife works as well, and that affords us some opportunities that we might not have based on my salary alone but I'm certainly not required to live an overly simple lifestyle because I've chosen lay ministry as a career. Will I make six figures as a high school principal? No. Do I need to make six figures? No. Can I be happy with less than six figures? Absolutely. That's a decision that I made that wasn't necessarily important to me.

What makes you good at what you do?

I learned very early that in my profession as principal that we're cast into two different categories: as either desk people to have a tendency to be in their office most of the day probably being very productive but then there's the other group that I would fall into, and that would be the group that would prefer to be out amongst the students in the hallway, interacting with staff and parents. I came into the position where my predecessor was a desk person so I immediately learned that one of the things that others appreciated about me was the fact that I was present in the hallways, in the classrooms, at the athletic events and that was a natural interest of mine. I would not have wanted to be passing most of the day in my office. I found that work had to be done at some point, and that was either something that got done after school or on the weekends. I guess if I had to define a gift that I've become aware that I have or that others perceive that I have is having an interest in them and in what they're doing and wanting to be aware of what is going on in the building. Now that I have 2 children, I imagine what their education experience will be like. So a lot of times I imagine my children being in school and what type of environment would I want for them? Would I want this individual teaching my children? Or what content would be more practical or more something they're going to use more in life? So I try to incorporate that as principal of this school. I know if it's not good enough for my kids then it's not good enough for the school. I guess my gifts are more an extraverted way. As principal where a lot of things are happening spur of the moment and you're in contact with a lot of different people and you're trying to keep the students satisfied and you're trying to keep your clients (the parents) satisfied and the teachers as well, it's an exciting job and everyday is different than the one before it. I know a lot of people and their jobs involve a routine. A principal has no routine.

So if you're someone who likes to think on your feet and you're someone who likes to incorporate all those life experiences you had and just kind of rely on them intuitively to get you through your day as opposed to being sitting in front of a monitor or being chained to a desk, so to speak, it's a great job.

Can you make the link for us between baptism and the call to ministry?

I've often reflected that obviously when you're baptized and even when a lot of us are confirmed, we have little idea of what we're getting into. I think when you're baptized, you begin your life's journey as a Christian, as a disciple of Christ and that carries ultimately certain responsibilities, obligations, guilt at times and so I think as you go through life it becomes the grid from which you see life that is you see life as a catholic, as a Christian. So inevitably when you go to make decisions later in life, particularly in what profession you may go into, who you're looking for as a life's partner, you can't help but consider faith, and whether consciously or unconsciously that's going to enter into that decision making process. So I think as a baptized catholic, in a sense I had little choice as I went through life. I was going to consider things or reflect on things in a way I might not have if I had not been baptized, if that wasn't an emphasis in our home growing up.

What would you say to encourage others to consider lay ministry?

I think a lot of people--if they choose a profession based on monetary rewards—I think that will only bring them so much satisfaction. Hopefully you will like what you do, and if you get a charge or if you feel a sense of satisfaction of serving other people and you can make that stretch in your job or profession that also has that service component to it in addition to satisfying you're standard of living, I think that, that is the bonus. And I think we're all looking at that special life experience or that unique life experience. And if you can gain satisfaction beyond the monetary aspects of your job, lay ministry is an area where people are often able to find that. So if I was talking with someone about considering lay ministry, I would ask them to think beyond the pay check. What makes you tick? And if serving other people and hopefully influencing the lives of young people as an educator might do, I think that could be very rewarding in addition to the monetary rewards.

You love what you do, don't you?

Yes. I've had jobs before when that alarm went off in the morning I didn't exactly want to leap out of bed and I don't have that sense anymore. I'm not sure exactly how that happened but I know that certainly what I'm doing during the day in my job has a lot to do with that. I find myself—and this would shock some people that knew me--I find myself wanting to go back to work on the weekends or in the evenings.

I do like where I'm headed everyday and I often do find myself after being home for a couple of hours and spending time with my family, I do find myself wanting to go back. So as a high school principal, I do have a sense of ownership, much like I think a businessman or a businesswoman would have about their business. I do have a sense of ownership about the school and I find myself wanting to invest time into it. I find myself loving my job much more, and in different ways than I did jobs in business that I had.

How did your friends react to your career change? They saw you leave a highly visible, high profile job to take this job as a high school principal?

I actually remember a remark that an elderly neighbor made to me when I first got into teaching and he asked me what I was planning on doing. When I told him I was going to be a teacher, he kind of stepped back and he made the remark, how are you going to feel when your buddies start buying Cadillac's, and homes? How are you going to feel then? He had been someone who had spent his life being an engineer and I reflected on that on several occasions. I'm glad that I never felt any real sense of envy let's say for my friends that were doing well economically. I think I always had that sense that I was gaining something in areas in my job that they maybe were not getting in theirs so as far as my friends reacting to it, my friends knew that I liked sales and was doing fairly well at it but I think they also knew or remembered the satisfaction that I had as a teacher prior to going into sales. I don't remember any real strong reactions. I think being in my mid-thirties that by now, most people have realized that it's not all about money and how much you make, it's about how you feel.

Describe your support system and how your wife helps keep you on track in your ministry.

My wife is also a product of catholic schools so she has always appreciated my desire to being in catholic education. She works as well, so between our two incomes we're able to live a comfortable lifestyle. My wife is also a practicing catholic and we have two daughters who have been baptized, and we already have their catholic high school picked out – Mercy High School! (Even though they're 2 1/2 and 10 months.) So the support is there in terms of my wife having attended catholic schools, having had some of the same experiences, memories, influences, that I had so she appreciates the fact that I want to be a catholic school administrator. She probably wouldn't mind it if it paid a little more but I know that she's always supported that.

How are the seniors (students) in your school preparing for their futures? Are you able to share your philosophy of life with them? How do they react to it?

Probably goes in one ear and out the other but I had an experience last year where we had our seniors in the room and we went around and asked each senior what their plans were after graduation and then looking even further ahead to what they might be considering as a profession. You had a lot of the typical responses, I want to be an athlete, or I want to be in business or I want to be an engineer or a doctor, or a lawyer and it struck me that no one specifically referred to lay ministry or working for the church. I want to think that a couple of the female students might have referred to wanting to be grade school teachers, but all in all it occurred to me that young people do not necessarily think about lay ministry as a profession and I think it would be neat to go around a classroom of young people--particularly those who have grown up in the church and in that catholic and parochial school environment--and to have them thinking at 16, 17, 18 years old, that working for the church or considering a career in social work , lay ministry would become more and more appealing to young people. I know we go through cycles as a society and perhaps in the future we'll see kind of a greater enlightenment in that way where young people are able to see beyond the standard status symbols, the cars, the house and consider what would make them happy.

What are some of your gifts?

I think that the gifts that I bring to my job as a catholic high school principal would be an extraverted personality. I enjoy interacting with people. I naturally interact with faculty, with students, with parents, with visitors to our school. I feel a sense of ownership to our school and I like showing our school off. I like showing people what we're doing. That also incorporates another one of my gifts and that would be experience in sales. I think a natural salesmanship if you will, selling our school, attracting students to our school is a big part of my job so I often do find myself marketing our school. I hope that I'm a good listener because in my job we have to listen quite a bit whether it be listening to a student, to a parent, a teacher making quick decisions based on what they're sharing with you, trying to help them find solutions or better find their own solution but listening is an important part of my job. I'm a hyper person so I'm not often able to sit for long periods of time and in my job I think that can be a gift in that the students and the staff, I think, appreciate an administrator as aware of what they're doing and as aware of the efforts that they're putting forth in the classroom instead of learning of their lesson plans on paper—to actually see them. We all like to be affirmed. I'm constantly affirming people. To see a young person who's affirmed, an older person that's affirmed—that's satisfying. So that's the fun part of my job—being able to say "good job" on that test, or "that sounded really interesting what you were teaching in there today" So those are some of the gifts that I bring to my job as principal.

What are some of the hats you wear in life and profession?

My name is Chris Ciagne and some of the hats that I wear are that of husband, father, high school principal, practicing catholic, sports fan, within my job I'm also a teacher, I also serve as dean of discipline,

Was there a key person in your life who mentored you?

When I was a teenager, like a lot of other young people, I didn't always make the best decisions and for lack of a better term, you know I was a juvenile delinquent at times and I got into trouble with the law. I was fortunate at my school that there was someone that my parents sought out and that was my freshman theology teacher in high school. He also happened to serve as the guidance counselor in the school. So this gentleman, beginning my freshman year in the late 70's, would arrive at school one hour early and I was dropped off one hour early several days a week. This Christian Brother would spend time discussing my life with me, my concerns, my goals; he encouraged me to get involved in student government, in sports and the other extra curricular activities that were offered at my high school. My parents on the other hand, were encouraging me to get involved with a different crowd. I have always considered that Christian brother, who I'm still in touch with nearly 25 years later—we get together every year out west and go camping together, retreat together—and we have a lot of those same discussions today that we had when I was 14 years old and going through a phase as I think kind of a troubled teenager or someone without a lot of direction in my life. So I credit Brother Anthony Cannon in particular with playing an influence in my life, unlike anyone outside of my parents. And I could say that of a number of the Christian brothers of Ireland that taught me at Brother Rice High School as well as my lay teachers and coaches as well. That experience in particular with Brother Cannon when I was 23 years old thinking about "ok, what are you going to do with your life?" it was the image of people like Brother Cannon that came to mind and ultimately prompted me to go into education.

Are there any other people or events you feel influenced you career path?

I remember when I was in business specifically working with ticket sales at the Detroit Tigers, I made the acquaintance of a catholic priest a Fr. Tom Lumpkin who ran the Dorothy Day House, kitty corner to tiger stadium. Fr. Lumpkin came over to buy group tickets so he could bring the Dorothy Day Home residents to a game and we began talking. We developed a friendship over the years and I remember at sometimes I would lament to him that I felt a certain void in my life and in my job. I had gone from education and this sense that I was making a difference--much like throwing a pebble into a pond the ripple effect that you might have—a sense that you're imparting as a teacher. I didn't feel that I had that and I remember Fr. Tom would stress that regardless of what you do 9 to 5 that you can still have that impact on people around you that you can still live your faith in any work environment. And while I did find that to be true, I did feel that there obviously in a secular environment that were limitations to that and sometimes I find myself now sitting in principals meetings where we're being led in song and prayer and I look around and I'm humored thinking about being back in a board room or business environment singing "Let there Be Peace on Earth" with my colleagues. It was something that while I think you could make that attempt in other professions, I think that you'll find yourself better able to express your faith and share your faith in what you do in an environment like a parochial school or in lay ministry.

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